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Post by Ptarmigan on Apr 4, 2008 0:43:58 GMT
Thanks to the Bluegrass Ireland Blog for this news. If you missed the recent tour by the Carolina Chocolate Drops, or if you did catch it and would just love to watch it again, then here's some great news. Follow this link to view 18 of their songs/tunes ~ the picture quality is excellent. It was shot during their concert at the Paradiso in Amsterdam on FabChannel. CAROLINA CHOCOLATE DROPS ~ LIVE IN CONCERTCheers Dick P.S. Just noticed that Richard got this from our friends over at FOAOTMAD
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Post by deleuran on Apr 4, 2008 15:07:11 GMT
Thank you. That's a great one. That Mountain Dew is really good. And Georgia Buck.
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Post by tobias on Apr 5, 2008 9:10:07 GMT
Thanks for the link Dick.
I must admit that I don't really get it, when it comes to the Chocolate Drops. I dont think they are very good. Sorry. To me they seem to be making more of a racket than music. The fiddling on many tracks is very stiff (rarely breacking the shuffle rhythm) and with bad intonation. The guitar is just banging away and the same with the banjo. Frailing in its most extreme. Some of these things are heard and accepted on old field recordings by old musicians, but the standarts are set much higher today, and I dont think the Drops live up to those. Maybe its their live performance that makes them so talked about, but I'm not impressed....sorry :-(
/Tobias
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Post by john on Apr 5, 2008 12:25:48 GMT
Oh oh,
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Post by john on Apr 5, 2008 12:26:20 GMT
My first impression of CCD was was very much the same as TobiasĀ“s but slowly I have changed my mind over the last 3 years. I find them very interesting and I look forward to see and hear them in Denmark.
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Post by deleuran on Apr 5, 2008 14:45:53 GMT
Harsh words Tobias. Isn't that a bit unfair? I admit that when seeing the video I was not totally crazy about the guitarplayer, Too much noise and lack of refinement, and when he sang he was out of key too often. The banjo he plays is a 4 string, and there's probably not much else to do than frail. I like Rhiannon Giddens very much. She sings very well, and plays a very fine fiddle in my ears. And she's a looker too As I said yesterday, I have some I like more than others from the video. Among others Georgia Buck and especially Mountain Dew, is a very fine number. And a couple of others too. Well if frailing is what they do, frailing it is. Nothing wrong with that. And as I see that they are classified as blues in different places, we must consider too, that they are not a white old-time band, but a black band with a different musical heritage. But OK. If you don't like it, you don't like it. But try to listen to the tunes they have on their MySpace profile, before you totally condemn them. Very fine music there. More blues than old time though. But then again. Nothing wrong with that.
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Post by Ptarmigan on Apr 5, 2008 15:45:45 GMT
Interesting reply Tobias. but hey, you are of course entitled to your opinion. God forbid that we should all love the same music. However, before I reply, I'd just like to make one thing clear, I'm not going to try & defend the CCDs, for me their music does that by itself, but I will try & explain just why I love their music. I have now seen them live & as you may have noticed from my brief report, they blew me away, so perhaps I have an advantage over you Tobias. Having said that, I loved their sound, even when I first heard it on their MySpace & CD, but then I know I do tend to favour much more of a Blues mix to my Old Time than Bluegrass or Country. You may be interested to know that during their concert, they did mention the fact that they have an old OT musician in their area who has been a kind of mentor, & this guy as I understand it has lived & played through most of the years Old Time has been around { } & he has been an inspiration to them. So I believe they do look back to the original sounds, & perhaps this is why they sound like "old field recordings" to you. I must say though, for me this is no bad thing, in my book. In doing this, they will quite naturally risk alienating Old Time fans who prefer their music to be more polished, but thankfully I'm not one of those. I love my music raw & that's certainly what these guys deliver. Their music sounds about as real as you can get & from the heart too, not the brain, which is where honest music should come from. I was actually chatting about this kind of thing last night at the session. My friend had been to a festival recently, at which a famous band were performing & he jammed with them but was very disappointed. Apparently, in his opinion they were slick to the point that all their music has started to sound almost perfect ~ it just sounds far to automatic too, note & intonation perfect, which for me too is not what real traditional music should be all about. If I want that kind of music I'll switch on the Classic FM station. In fact, this is exactly why I don't bother going to trad Irish concerts any more. I find the music just too polished, too slick, to the point of being quite simply bland! Give me a session, with bum notes a-flying, raw edges, blood & guts & dirty, filthy, mucky music & I'm as happy as a Pig in Sh*t! Remember that old slogan ~ KEEP MUSIC LIVE! ;D Anyway, I really do hope that they make Denmark & Sweden the next time they're over. Cheers Dick
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Post by tobias on Apr 5, 2008 15:49:07 GMT
Harsh words Tobias. Isn't that a bit unfair? I admit that when seeing the video I was not totally crazy about the guitarplayer, Too much noise and lack of refinement, and when he sang he was out of key too often. The banjo he plays is a 4 string, and there's probably not much else to do than frail. I like Rhiannon Giddens very much. She sings very well, and plays a very fine fiddle in my ears. And she's a looker too As I said yesterday, I have some I like more than others from the video. Among others Georgia Buck and especially Mountain Dew, is a very fine number. And a couple of others too. Well if frailing is what they do, frailing it is. The way you feel about the guitar is how I feel about the banjoplaying (5-string). Missing some refinement. I actually like 4-string playing better :-) He has some cool bluesy effects and rolls. Giddens has a good singing voice. A little to pretty for my taste...but thats just my taste :-) Her fiddling is fine too. As long as its not to fast. Then it gets very stiff. I know that some consider them more blues than OT, but they do have some OT Stringband tunes, so I think its fair to compare those tunes with others playing OT stringband. About their heritage, then I know that they are very much inspired by Joe Thompson...and probably also his cousin Odell. He played frailing banjo very much the same way. But listened to the recording of Joe Thompson playing Georgie Buck. He is backed up by Bob Carlin on a very tastefull clawhammer banjo. Granted, the energy doesn't match the CCD, but Joe is quite old. I prefer this stuff. www.bobcarlinmusic.com/producer/listening-room.htm- Go down to Family Tradition. I would still go see them if they came to Denmark. I am sure they put on a good show and are friendly people :-) /Tobias
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Post by tobias on Apr 5, 2008 16:11:50 GMT
So I believe they do look back to the original sounds, & perhaps this is why they sound like "old field recordings" to you. I must say though, for me this is no bad thing, in my book. In doing this, they will quite naturally risk alienating Old Time fans who prefer their music to be more polished, but thankfully I'm not one of those. I love my music raw & that's certainly what these guys deliver. Their music sounds about as real as you can get & from the heart too, not the brain, which is where honest music should come from. I love the old field recordings and use those as my main inspiration. But alot of the playing "doesn't sound very good". The musicians are often very old...or they are just not very good. But its OK, because its more like a historical record. A glimpse of the old tunes or bowing styles. So fiddlers learn from them and copy it...But also try to improve it. Getting the tone better for instance. Alot of people tried to copy Tommy Jarrell, but not many tried to copy his mistakes and tone (which could be quite poor). I feel that the CCB aren't so much "copying the old sound", but are more likely just not that great musicians (yet). I think they just decided to play it in public to early. I'm sorry that this might sound provoking, but it is none the less how I feel...sorry...Luckely my opinion doesn't match public opinion, since they are doing so well. :-) I love my music raw as well :-) I don't care much for very polished music either. But I think that calling something raw as an excuse for it being bad, is not a good solution. It's like the difference between abstract art coming from a painter with a good technical background as opposed to an amateur/hobby painter making an abstract painting. There is a difference. Note...I am NOT saying the CCB is THAT bad. Its just a thought on "rawness" as opposed to "undeveloped technique". ...just read what I wrote...Geez, it sounds harsh. I doen't think that they suck as much as it sounds like. Its just hard to explain what I mean without it sounding harsh. /Tobias-"I am actually a nice guy"-Enevoldsen
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Post by john on Apr 5, 2008 16:24:24 GMT
And dont forget you can allways change the channel if you dont dig the sound of the band cheers, john ps. I know what you mean !
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Post by john on Apr 5, 2008 16:32:09 GMT
I once saw the vhs The Story of the American Banjo. It starts off with 2 black Americans and they are old sitting and playing the tune and songs they learned when they were young men. And it was exactly the same frailing and groove like the CCD. Buckdancing as well. Let`s Have a Ruckus t`night
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Post by tobias on Apr 5, 2008 16:38:45 GMT
I once saw the vhs The Story of the American Banjo. It starts off with 2 black Americans and they are old sitting and playing the tune and songs they learned when they were young men. And it was exactly the same frailing and groove like the CCD. Buckdancing as well. Let`s Have a Ruckus t`night Maybe that was Joe and Odell Thompson. They were on Mike Seegers "Old-time banjo styles" DVD as well. Their influence on CCB is quite evident. /Tobias
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Post by deleuran on Apr 5, 2008 17:01:14 GMT
I feel like defending Tobias a little, though we disagree on this subject. He is my friend and my bandmate. But we often disagree on musical matters. Mostly in writing. We can argue heavily in e-mails, but luckily we don't drag it with us into the rehearsing room I can tell that is there anybody who are into the old field recordings and the raw stuff, it is Tobias. I guess I am the one in our band who is a sucker for the virtuos stuff. Not that I don't like the raw stuff. I like many kinds of music, as long as you can feel the heart in it. But with that said, Tobias, I wonder, did you hear/see the whole concert with CCD? I did, and I admit it had it's ups and downs, but I must say, that I heard the ups several times. When they are good they are really good.
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Post by john on Apr 5, 2008 18:31:59 GMT
Raw stuff, just an excuse for playing false?? Or? ? I do not find CCD raw at all. But it is hammer on! I am glad to see that Jesper is a sucker for the virtuos stuff. So am I. And I find that CCD is the band right now who can provide us with the sound and feel from way back. The link mentioned by Dick, well it is a fine concert but the sound technician is fast a sleep! The so called banging from the guitar is due to bad sound engineering. And singing out of key, well, with bad monitoring it is easy to sing out of key. Listening to the rest by CCD on the net gives a very fine impression of a very fine band delivering a show to watch and listen to. If the bands over there and specially here could play with just half of the joy and musician ship it would be great. I had a tread where I asked if anyone was interested in a CCD Denmark tour. It has been open for most of the day. No one have answered yet, so I have removed the tread and will use my money on something else. You got the chance !!! cheers, John ps. I do not want to have a discuss for the sake of having a discuss. have fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If you are ailing just keep frailing play a breakdown when you are blue Let your friends and neighbour see the country side of you.
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Post by deleuran on Apr 5, 2008 19:59:25 GMT
AW! F*ck John! Now we'll never get to see CCD in Denmark I missed my chance I guess you're right.
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Post by Ptarmigan on Apr 5, 2008 23:59:54 GMT
John, I admit, that does happen, but you have to admit too, that there's a world of difference between quality raw playing & plain, raw crappy playing, that comes from players with no talent. See this band live & you will have absolutely no doubt which bracket they fall into. Incidentally, for your information, here's what some of the guys over at the Banjo Hangout say about this clip: Of course, I'm sure most of the folks who responded have actually seen them live Tobias, so I reckon you should perhaps reserve judgement, until you guys can persuade them to tour Denmark. Cheers Dick
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hunter
Old Time Jews Harp Player
Posts: 42
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Post by hunter on Apr 6, 2008 4:39:02 GMT
I saw them play here in... January I guess. The music was pretty good and they put on a great show. I liked it much better than the one CD I have. The banjo playing is pretty basic, but I like that better than a lot of the over prettified stuff so many people seem to be aiming for these days.
Hunter
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Post by Ptarmigan on Apr 6, 2008 10:06:00 GMT
Yes Hunter, after playing the Banjo for 3 weeks now, "pretty basic" is exactly the style I'm aiming for. I just received a John Balch CD yesterday - "Carry on John". Now I must admit, the music is nice, & John can certainly play Banjo & I'm sure he can mix it with the best in an OT jam too, but the music on this CD is a little too pretty to grab me by the short & curlies. It touches different nerve ends from someone like say Andrew Epstein of the Gilded Bats, whose playing really kicks ass for me - I just love that. I love his energy & what really floats my boat is when it sounds like a musician is living on the egde, taking chances & sounding like he or she is playing with a certain amount of gay abandon to coin an old, out of date I guess, phrase. So I'll enjoy listening to John's CD OK, when I'm in the mood to relax & just let it gently wash over me, but when I'm in the mood for rocking, I always reach for the Bats. So yup, there's a place for the "over prettified stuff" too, & of course for many other styles in between, but I too prefer musicians who are not afraid to live on the edge. I also got Bob Carlin's - Fiddle Tunes for CH Banjo yesterday & that boy can certainly play a Banjo. Just makes me realize that I have a long, long, long road to travel. Sh*t, I'm still getting all sorts of ugly scrapes & banging sounds as my right hands fumbles for the strings ...... ah well, onwards & upwards. Cheers Dick P.S. Hunter, next time you meet Andrew Epstein, ask him when he's going to put out a solo CD?
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Post by tobias on Apr 6, 2008 10:50:33 GMT
Thats a whole heap o' quotes praysing the CCD. I know my oppinion is outnumbered. Well so be it...
That quote: "By far my favorite OT group."
Really!? With all the bands out there? I'm sorry, but they don't come anywhere near Foghorn Stringband. Not in playing skills or energy. Not close to The Wilders, The Gilded Bats, Freighthoppers, Red Hots and many more either. CCB aint that bad, but the best? I don't think so.
I have listened to 2 CDs with the CCD. "Donna's got a ramblin' mind" and "Heritage" and I must give them credit that they are better there, than on this concert footage. I think, all in all, the thing that mainly turns me off, is the fiddling. Thats the part I cant get into. Its so stiff and stale. Sure he plays fast, but it suffers from it. He (and her, when the Rhiannon is playing fast fiddletunes)very rarely breaks the shuffle pattern. Its just 1--2 And 3--4 And 1--2 And....etc. I know that their mentor Joe Thompson used this lick alot, but listen to his version of Georgie Buck...He breaks the pattern once in a while, and enphasises some more notes... ...I dont know...I just don't dig it... :-(
Dick. Glad you like The Gilded Bats. You get no argument from me there ;-) I like them fellas too. Been listening to them quite alot lately.
/Tobias
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Post by Ptarmigan on Apr 6, 2008 11:20:04 GMT
Yes Tobias, I agree, CCD wouldn't be my favourite OT group either, but then to be honest, I don't think I could ever pick just one favourite. In any case, I always think it's a little unfair to say any group is better than any other. After all, each group has their own voice & is trying to say something a little different from the next one. All any of us can really say is that we like the sound of one group more than another, but that doesn't actually mean they are better, it just means we, as an individual, like their sound more than the sound others make. For the same reasons, I just don't like all the Irish music competitions that happen over here each year - like the All Ireland Fleadh. But everyone to their own. So of course, as expected, we must simply agree to disagree, which is fine & healthy & is, after all, what discussions are all about - simply sharing views. Ah the Bats - when will they tour over here? Cheers Dick
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